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OOC goes here, not on other boards.

maaaaaaan i'm gonna have to start posting somehow ;-; i'm like so rp deprived its messing with my head. Dx

yeeesss... the withdrawal effects are working just as planned... soooooon i shall take over thundddarrraaaa....

ashe goes pew, pew, pew, pew, pew
trynd goes RAWRL

Thought I would apologize- I will be on a bit less this week because I'm trying to get into college. It's a long story as to why it has taken the entirety of the summer to finally get signed up- but I have to look into loans, classes, housing, etc within the next couple of weeks. Thus- my activity on site may slow down a bit... but I will at least be on once per day- and I will probably be on at night unless I pass out from work or running around town on my bike or whatever.

At any rate- apologies if any threads get held up. I will do what I can to remain as active as possible.

Also- this:

REPOST!
*hurls stones*
YARG!

but ya, hope everything turns out good w/the process
shin supports teh education!

Repost? I AM A FAILURE

Whooo!!! I'm going to the Electric Daisy Carnival Event locally tomorrow!

And I'm getting paid!

I'm bringing my effing glowsticks!

You have to go to the real thing when you get a chance. There's one in Orlando, but nothing compares to the LA/Vegas EDC. ^_^ Tho, most of my friends have no intentions of attending that movie. But that's b/c we dislike Insomniac.

muuhuuuhahahhaha

So over on my guild, we're giving away a free Collector's Edition to whichever member does the best promotion for us in public.

So, I present for your amusement: What a woman will do for a free CE

Wow.

I think I've overextended myself...

...so if you all see me around less than usual this coming week, it's because I'm trying to clear my head. It feels all gunked up.

Guhhuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhh

Don't worry all- I am alive. Combination of school stuff- work stuff and house stuff. Mass Effect isn't helping much either >_>;

At any rate- regular posting will resume sometime tomorrow. For now- I rest.

Mass Effect <3

lol... "mass"... heh heh... "effect"... heh heh heh...

YO

i'll be all up and in meetings today, so i prolly won't be able to approve nothing. i'll check the boards now and holla atchall tomorrow. in the meantime smart ppl post thoughts on this:

Quote :

Worker Units
Shin, I was looking over the buildings sections on the site and right now, the only useful units are Builders and Soldiers. We have advanced buildings that boost the other workers, but they are obsolete. All buildings merely require BP, but makes no reference to the resources involved. How does one build a Stone Wall with no miners or merchants? Who is purchasing and transporting all this stone or wood for that matter? In order to make the other worker types useful, I would propose:

1) # of Naturalists are needed for Wood or lower projects
1 common item per 5 BP
2) # of Miners are needed for Stone projects
1 common item per 10 BP
3) Archaeologists or Alchemists are needed for Scrap Metal projects
1 common item per 10 BP
4) Merchants or Supporters can be used to acquire building materials of any kind
1 common items per 5 BP

Merchants/Supporters are able to purchase any type of materials (wood, stone, scrap metal). In order to keep Miners, Archaeologists, and Alchemists from becoming obsolete, it's more expensive to get all your goods via merchants/supporters b/c this is accounting for travel and expenses + their "wages".

Worker Outputs
In terms of what one can get with worker units, if someone had enough Alchemists, Archaeologists, or Naturalists could someone use them how Teksearchers were meant to be in order request projects like creating an herbal supplement that cures poison or using Alchemist to create poisons or vaccines or city defensive traps, and Naturalists could create new farming/hunting techniques that increase output on the land. Obviously, it would have to be proposed on the Permission Board and you could then set a time limit for how long something might take.

Default BP costs
Are those values listed for wood? Like Medium House and such?

And I'm back. Sort of. School is being a bitch and, from the looks of things (unless something changes in the meetings I am going to today), I will have to wait another semester until I can actually start. I apologize beforehand if I show any... irritability. I will be a full year and a half behind my graduating class by the time I start college and I'm not taking it well. Doesn't help too much that while I did all of the paperwork and everything, my university is simply dragging their feet about things as far as I can tell.

Regardless, posting will resume today once I get back from my meetings (around 5 or so Ohio time). My mood will be dependant on whether or not I get stuck in the middle of more beauracratic bullshit or not.

Apologies once again for sucking it up these last few days when it came to being active. I've been dying to get into school for the last year and I've been too stressed/on the phone too much/releasing my anger into the skulls of aliens bent on destryong the galaxy to properly write anything. Believe me- I've tried.

At any rate- I will see y'all later today- hopefully with some good news.

Also, this:

I'm in and out X3 sort of partial back

Spoiler:

hahaha epic xD didnt know you guys were playing LoL, to bad you are on NA servers thougth D:

Shintre wrote:

lol... "mass"... heh heh... "effect"... heh heh heh...

YO

i'll be all up and in meetings today, so i prolly won't be able to approve nothing. i'll check the boards now and holla atchall tomorrow. in the meantime smart ppl post thoughts on this:

Quote :

Worker Units
Shin, I was looking over the buildings sections on the site and right now, the only useful units are Builders and Soldiers. We have advanced buildings that boost the other workers, but they are obsolete. All buildings merely require BP, but makes no reference to the resources involved. How does one build a Stone Wall with no miners or merchants? Who is purchasing and transporting all this stone or wood for that matter? In order to make the other worker types useful, I would propose:

1) # of Naturalists are needed for Wood or lower projects
1 common item per 5 BP
2) # of Miners are needed for Stone projects
1 common item per 10 BP
3) Archaeologists or Alchemists are needed for Scrap Metal projects
1 common item per 10 BP
4) Merchants or Supporters can be used to acquire building materials of any kind
1 common items per 5 BP

Merchants/Supporters are able to purchase any type of materials (wood, stone, scrap metal). In order to keep Miners, Archaeologists, and Alchemists from becoming obsolete, it's more expensive to get all your goods via merchants/supporters b/c this is accounting for travel and expenses + their "wages".

Worker Outputs
In terms of what one can get with worker units, if someone had enough Alchemists, Archaeologists, or Naturalists could someone use them how Teksearchers were meant to be in order request projects like creating an herbal supplement that cures poison or using Alchemist to create poisons or vaccines or city defensive traps, and Naturalists could create new farming/hunting techniques that increase output on the land. Obviously, it would have to be proposed on the Permission Board and you could then set a time limit for how long something might take.

Default BP costs
Are those values listed for wood? Like Medium House and such?

Hmm I say no. BP is already pointless why add to something like that?

Eri wrote:

Hmm I say no. BP is already pointless why add to something like that?

Quote :

Fact and Opinion

A fact is something that is true about a subject and can be tested or proven.
Look for clues such as: " 56% of...., or "The patient experienced..."

An opinion is what someone thinks about that subject.
Look for clues such as: "I believe...", "It's obvious...", or "They should..."

when u say somethin's pointless you gotta kinda back that up w/a reason why
b/c so far, you've said stuff is dumb about things you didn't even understand
so =/

I'd say that I kinda like the idea if I'm understanding it right

You asked for our thoughts on it was so I give it too ya. Sorry wont happen again.

ah! you sholl right. i did ask for thoughts.
i thought i said to discuss
ty eri and hara for ur thoughts
now the overall topic of what to do to make worker's have use system wise is up for detailed discussion
ppreciate it

I'll just say I think it's an absolutely terrible idea. There's no reason to start making things that complicated. People who go the military route are already handicapped enough when it comes to wanting to build things, so why add more and more on top of it?

It's just going to pile more and more work onto something that's already enough work as it is. It's going to get to the point where it's pointless to even bother doing it, because instead of putting all this WC into getting all these specialty workers and shit like that I can just put WC into getting warriors/piling experience into them and my own personal power, and then take all your shit. Which honestly isn't as fun to me.

So, tl;dl version is: with the amount of people RPing on this site right now, it's too complex for it's own good, and wouldn't be worth investing in from a player's perspective and would completely kill my own interest in it, which would suck since that's my huge draw for RPing.

I would have to agree with Lydeck. The system as it is now works pretty well for what it does, though I dislike how I had to recruit builders in order to build things instead of making my house bit by bit in character- but that's beside the point.

My vote goes to keep the building system as is- though I like that we can trade BP for items. I would not complain if we were still able to do that (can we already do that?).

Phew, I has an alt account on UK West. Add "Little Nomad" :3

Video!:

Quote :

Worker Units
Shin, I was looking over the buildings sections on the site and right now, the only useful units are Builders and Soldiers. We have advanced buildings that boost the other workers, but they are obsolete. All buildings merely require BP, but makes no reference to the resources involved. How does one build a Stone Wall with no miners or merchants? Who is purchasing and transporting all this stone or wood for that matter?

Well, keep in mind that the world has only been around for 20 years. I don't think that we'd have labor quite that specialized yet. For example, we have ancient settlements like this that were made during Neolithic times. There weren't more than 50 people living in it. I'm sure that they weren't so specialized that they had 2 people to dig up the stones, 2 people to carry it, and 2 people to sell it to another 2 people to build it. That's a manifestation of our modern division of labor. In ancient times, people did things from start to finish and either used slave labor or the labor of people who would directly benefit from the structure (link).

Default BP costs
Are those values listed for wood? Like Medium House and such?

They're for stone structures with standard flooring unless otherwise specified

I think Kaz has the right idea to some extent, but I think there is a simpler way to make economic units more useful:

Quote :

Naturalist: Agricultural worker or one who studies the earth and natural sciences. Generates 1 common item (i.e. herbal supplement) worth per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 15 BP discount towards landscaping projects, wooden buildings, moats, or straw buildings

Archeologist: Studies relics from the old world. Generates 1 common item (i.e. teaching, items) worth per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 15 BP discount towards schools or trade schools

Miner: Ore related worker. Generates 1 common item (i.e. teaching, items) worth per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 15 BP discount towards quarries, mineshafts, stone buildings, and flooring

Alchemist: Studies magic and spiritual energies. Generates 1 common item (i.e. potion) worth per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 15 BP discount towards temples and mystic altars

Merchant: Barters items. Generates 1 common item worth per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 5 BP discount towards any building type

Supporters: Supports a Celebrity, Church or Politician. Generates 1 common item (i.e. tithe) per week each.
:: > Common item can be traded for a 15 BP discount towards monuments and military buildings

Builder: Used for building up or reclaiming land and structures. Generates 1 build/repair point per day each.
:: > Build points can be used to create buildings once the appropriate amount of points has been reached. At least 1 builder is required to initiate a building project.

Quote :

Employable Unit rates:
Mercenary: 1 soldier works for 1 common item per IC day. Assume that they can move 5 squares per day, as the cost of travel to the engagement should be accounted for.

To make military units more useful in this context:

Quote :

Slavery/Indentured Servitude System
> Slaves cost 1 common item to acquire (Primitive/Temporary Housing) and 1 common item per week to maintain (Food)
:: > Housing costs can be exempted by having structures already in place. Twice as many slaves as civilians can live in a structure.
> Slaves generate 2-20 build points per week each (determined by 10 roll x2) OR 2-20 very common items (determined by 10 roll x2).
> Along with each 10 roll, a 100 roll must be performed to determine whether or not the slaves successfully revolted after the project if you have more slaves than military members.
:: > Divide the size of your current military by the size of your slave population and multiply the result by 100. This is the chance of slave revolt failure. You may pay 5 very common items before the roll to increment this number by 1, providing better conditions. Multiple increments may be purchased.
:: > Make a 100 roll. If the result is higher than your chances of a failed revolt, then the slave revolt is successful. You lose all of your slaves. Make another 100 roll to determine what percentage of your current army you lose to the riots.

P.S.: I think that there should be a corollary that allows people with the OBC+ package to build a single structure by themselves. Maybe translate the OBC+ sizes to a certain amount of self-generated BP per month instead of going the discount route. Details forthcoming in a later post.

To the "discussion" before Kitsu's post, what that sounded like was "I don't like A, which is separate from B, so screw B." I'm not a fan of the whole you have to split ur path units between soldiers and workers, but it makes sense since Mare Maris is protected by 300 soldiers. So big armies are't all that necessary. Even besides that tho, if you look at what's available, it's really not as hard as u seem to think to create a decent sized force of worker units and soldiers.

The other thing is that it doesn't address the core issue that ppl seemed to avoid til Kitsu, ALL other units are currently useless b/c it's not like u have to arm ur own forces, feed ur forces, or really do anything for them after u acquire them so getting items is completely useless b/c there's no purpose to having a "wealthy" city, u don't get anything for it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Kitsu, 20 years seems like ample time when you have something already existing to study/copy. It would simply be the ppl who are good at this or that became Naturalists or Miners.

I like ur discount system as it gives units legitimate purpose (& it's a super easy edit).

Mercenaries look good b/c then that gives another use for the non-military units tho I can see this being abused by a Role 3 Character who gets Uncommon items per IRL day not per IC day. I would also say to limit the mercenaries to be per RP/battle. That will offset the costs of a campaign b/c that will get expensive QUICK.

Slave system: My turn to simplify. Use the old system, you pay items to acquire specific types of slaves (non military since the Merc system is on the table). For the revolt, leave that to be a Unit Commander Tactic so that ppl don't have to keep track of that all the time. Also, b/c some leaders might actually be nice to their slaves & treat them like citizens. I like the "random encounter" possibility, but the revolt seems like more of an IC caused occurrence.

OBC+: I'm inclined to agree with this one b/c the ability is based on the caster's imagination so the detail should be included b/c they would think about every tidbit & the little things they miss would be "added in" during the initial walkthrough of the building. What do u think about:
Stage 1: 25 BP building (on the train so I can't pull up sq ft)
Stage 2: 75 BP
Stage 3: 250 BP
Stage 4: 500 BP
Stage 5: 750 BP
Stage 6: 1250 BP (I believe this is right under Estate but enough for a Mansion; that's the target so that Builders don't become obsolete either with this)

With the BP setup, someone with the ability, Major Construction (Stage 5 OBC+) could build 3 Med Houses (I think those are 215 BP) at once. Someone would still roll for the ability (so that ppl don't try to keep it at Trained or Honed) b/c a crappy roll will cause the building to collapse or have lowered density.

Default Costs: Are u sure b/c that seems awfully low for stone structures?

THIS

OMG EPIC

gj kazzy and kitsu
u both got good points in there. i'll look and see what i like/don't like about it
(b/c i didn't like kaz's original suggestion >.>)

You realize her suggestion isn't that different from mine, right, hater?! It just made the reward more appealing/optional.

cookie monster still loves his cookies dont you dare give him veggies

Bandwidth owned.

Huh?

Kaito wrote:

It says bandwidth exceeded.

Ooooh. It's the video of Cookie Monster that we saw before where at the end, the chick like pets his shoulder and everyone said that's his gf. So yeah.

Kazatul wrote:

OBC+: I'm inclined to agree with this one b/c the ability is based on the caster's imagination so the detail should be included b/c they would think about every tidbit & the little things they miss would be "added in" during the initial walkthrough of the building. What do u think about:
Stage 1: 25 BP building (on the train so I can't pull up sq ft)
Stage 2: 75 BP
Stage 3: 250 BP
Stage 4: 500 BP
Stage 5: 750 BP
Stage 6: 1250 BP (I believe this is right under Estate but enough for a Mansion; that's the target so that Builders don't become obsolete either with this)

you talkin per month or per day?

Definitely not per month. If ur wanting to limit how quickly someone can build their structures, meet in the middle at per week, RP must be at least 200 words per stage dedicated to the process. This can easily be accomplished by discussing the preparations, clearing the building site, then building the structure section by section and refining it for interior design specifics like the furniture, sculptures of yourself and viola you easily have both ur WC and a detailed description of all major buildings or building clusters (at higher stages).

I like that

i like the 200 per stage idea... but my other concern is:

Quote :

P.S.: I think that there should be a corollary that allows people with the OBC+ package to build a single structure by themselves. Maybe translate the OBC+ sizes to a certain amount of self-generated BP per month instead of going the discount route. Details forthcoming in a later post.

Quote :

OBC+: I'm inclined to agree with this one b/c the ability is based on the caster's imagination so the detail should be included b/c they would think about every tidbit & the little things they miss would be "added in" during the initial walkthrough of the building. What do u think about:
Stage 1: 25 BP (sword)
Stage 2: 75 BP (totem pole)
Stage 3: 250 BP (1f house)
Stage 4: 500 BP (2f house)
Stage 5: 750 BP (plane)
Stage 6: 1250 BP (blimp)

i put the size reference beside the stage to set a ref. point for u. my thing is, OBC+ makes something w/a mass that big. it dun go into the intricate details, etc that's required to make a house. that's fine to make something temporary, but i think permanent structures are made a certain way that's diff from just making like a cement square and saying "it's a house." all that to say: ya you got the ability to make something that big look like a house but it aint really a house. just like you can't get the metal package and make a gun w/no idea on what's inside a gun.

it's b/c of that i wanted to make them % and not set in stone. i want the actual workers to put the finishing touches on it. it's like, you generate this wood house and like kaz said, the workers come and make sure everything's straight with it. checking over a structure would require BP b/c they gotta go over what's already there. so i guess then if you have enough BP to create something, the BP that the workers would have to use would be more like repair points then anything else.

it gets complicated b/c of the diff lvls AND stages of OBC. best way i can think of presenting something like that is a pop up chart.
whatcha think?

Tbh, you don't even have to change the actual tech, the BP breakdown would simply replace the OBC+ discount note in the building/worker section. I just think that a breakdown removes ambiguity and room for BS of well my house IRL is bigger than my neighbor's, blah blah, and it also allows the person to build multiple smaller buildings at once.

If I have OBC+ Stage 5 and I'm trying to provide housing for my people. I could create 3 Medium Houses and 4 Yurts to house 67 units of population. That allows for faster spurts, but it's still limited to once per week, so truth be told, I still benefit from having regular builders to continue on my other projects at the same time like working on farm land. Also, you need builders to build an estate b/c I capped it right under Estate. Also, it's an all or nothing usage, so like the Stage 5 for 3 MH & 4 Y example costs 745 BP thus would leave 5 BP remaining. It doesn't rollover, it's lost.

So yeah, my suggestion applies to the building system ONLY. Lastly, the difference between the gun and house reference is that everyone with OBC+ should have seen the inside of a
house... SOMEWHERE at some point in time, so they would know what's included inside of it and how things are set up.

Side Note: I think the worker discount from Kitsu's proposal should be claimed on the city/nation page as:
# Naturalist items
# Merchant items
etc...

That way members can't use personal items to drastically lower the costs of building stuff.

Well- it's official. I've lost all faith in life. Sorry for being terrible about posting these last few weeks. Between school, trying to get another house situated and everything else, I want to kill everything. I won't go into details, but I'll simply state that I am effectively being cockblocked of an education for another semester at the very least and it's driving me up a goddamned wall.

Once again, apologies for sucking absolute dick. Hopefully I can manage to get my stress under control enough to stop freaking out whenever more shit news comes from the university.

Possible suggestion: Take some of ur GEs at ur local cmmunity/junior college. Much cheaper & contrary to BS belief, the classes are the same if u have a good teacher. Hope things work out for u.

Don't have a vehicle. Can't make it to the nearest community college or I would do such things... even then I dont have enough money unless I got loans- which for some reason didn't go through despite the fact that I more than qualified for the FAFSA and whatnot. Considering burning the world down.

I'm sorry to hear that, I hope things get better for you and your situation. It's fine if you burn the 3d world, just save the 2d and all will be fine.

Long story short, things have been busy on my side too. Should be done by the end of the week. Peace and Chicken grease

Time to take a sigh of relief.

Loans got approved. Still unsure about housing- but things are finally looking up. I can stop preparing to burn the mortal realm and all of it's inhabitants... though I'm not entirely sure what I am going to do about sending all of the demons that I summoned back to their plane of existence.

Poasting shall resume shortly. Probs sometime tonight or tomorrow before work. Now that stress has been removed I can finally think straight enough for a long enough time to write >_>

i'm goin thru a lot so be patient w/me and how often i'm online. things should clear up for me in a week or so. but this did make me laugh, hopefully it'll do the same for you.

Pet Diaries:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! OMFG!!!! HILARIOUS!!

OMG ahahah XD thats just WAY to EPIC!!